{"id":29884,"date":"2021-10-03T13:16:13","date_gmt":"2021-10-03T11:16:13","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.expoflamenco.com\/archivo\/?p=29884"},"modified":"2021-10-03T15:08:48","modified_gmt":"2021-10-03T13:08:48","slug":"pepe-habichuela-old-flamenco-is-where-the-real-flamenco-is","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/expoflamenco.com\/archivo\/en\/interviews\/pepe-habichuela-old-flamenco-is-where-the-real-flamenco-is\/","title":{"rendered":"Pepe Habichuela: “Old flamenco is where the real flamenco is”"},"content":{"rendered":"

The guitar veteran Jos\u00e9 Antonio Carmona Carmona (Granada, 1944), otherwise known as the maestro Pepe Habichuela<\/strong>, is making news these days having received the Moments Prize, awarded by the festival of the same name – the 8th<\/sup> Independent International Popular Art and Culture Festival – in recognition of his contribution to Spain\u2019s countercultural scene. This event, by the way, will extend his appearances during the autumn to the cities of Madrid, Sevilla and M\u00e1laga. He happily takes it on. \u2018Yes, it could be true what they say about me\u2019, he admits.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

The gold medallist for Merit in the Fine Arts (2019) and grandson of Habichuela El Viejo started playing the guitar in the Sacromonte caves as a child. At 15 years old he went to Madrid to replace his brother Juan, who had set sail for the Americas, at the Torres Bermejas flamenco venue. \u2018I only took a plastic bag with a suit, some shoes, a tortilla<\/em> and a loaf of bread in it\u2019, he revealed in the documentary The Flamenco Clan: Herencia flamenco<\/em>, directed by the German Michael Meert. It was there that he played with the greats: Marchena, Valderrama, La Paquera, Fosforito, Camar\u00f3n y Enrique Morente. His discography includes A Mandeli<\/em> (1983), Habichuela en Rama<\/em> (1997), Yerba G\u00fcena<\/em> (2001) and Hands<\/em> (2010). He also recorded the album Homenaje a Chac\u00f3n<\/em> (1976) alongside Enrique Morente, which won the National Record Prize.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

Pepe Habichuela\u2019s prizegiving will take place on Friday 24th<\/sup> September in the Roca Gallery (Jos\u00e9 Abascal 57, Madrid) at 7pm, where the guitarist will be in conversation with the cultural journalist G\u00f3mez Gufi. Following the discussion, the \u2018Nuevos medios. \u00c9tica y Estetica\u2019 <\/em>exhibition will be opening, a collection of more than 40 record covers from the legendary label created in 1982 by Mario Pacheco and Cucha Salazar.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 The great independent culture event, Moments Festival, is awarding you their greatest honour. The organisers highlight that you have been instrumental in the revolution of jondo<\/em> and are a living witness of the history of contemporary flamenco. Do you recognise yourself in such descriptions?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 I\u2019m very pleased to be receiving this prize, which has been awarded to other very important artists. They are recognising the evolution of my career. I\u2019ve been playing the guitar since I was 14 or 15 years old, and now I am seventy seven. That\u2019s what I\u2019m proud of: to still be up on stage playing at my age. Guitar is my passion. And yes, it could be true what they say. I\u2019ve played with great international musicians –  Dave Holland, Jaco Pastorius, Don Cherry\u2026with great singers from the 50s, 60s and 70s. I do believe I\u2019ve contributed many things to flamenco. It\u2019s wonderful that even in 2021 they are recognising my journey through the flamenco stages.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 Do you also feel that recognition from your peers? In the profession.<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 I think so, yes. The flamencos<\/em> respect me, because I\u2019ve worked hard in this art. And I\u2019m still standing.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 You played to everyone.<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 Yes, everyone. Everyone who is no longer here: Valderrama, Morente, Camar\u00f3n, Marchena\u2026and now I am playing to all of the young people. That\u2019s really nice for me. Today\u2019s youngsters play my falsetas. That\u2019s hugely satisfying. They recognise my worth.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 Will there ever be another partnership of artists as great as the one to which you lent your guitar?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 It\u2019s difficult for people to reach that status. I learned a lot from older people.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 Like now they learn from you.<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 Indeed. Young people learn from artists of my age. From me and my brother Juan and our flamenco guitars. The grana\u00ednas<\/em> guitars we\u2019ve played all our lives.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 I read a wonderful phrase which you gave in an interview: that the singers you played with were doing \u2018new but old\u2019 flamenco. Is there any of that now?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 I think so, yes. Now there are young artists who sing very well, and young guitarists who play very well. I think this is a very beautiful time for flamenco.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 Could you name any new guitarist in particular?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 There\u2019s lots of people. My son Josemi Carmona is a brilliant musician. There\u2019s Diego del Morao, Antonio Rey…there\u2019s a load of young people playing the guitar really well. Extraordinary performances.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 You had Enrique Morente by your right side for thirty years. Let\u2019s talk about him.<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 That\u2019s right. Since the 70s we were together travelling in and outside of Spain. I learned a lot from him. He was a flamenco singing genius.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\"\"<\/a><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 There aren\u2019t many geniuses, are there?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 Not anymore. There used to be lots: Manolo Caracol, Marchena, Valderrama, Camar\u00f3n, Morente\u2026they were eternal geniuses.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 What are flamenco geniuses like?\u201d<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 They are connoisseurs of all of the flamenco palos<\/em> and have great passion. Morente and Camar\u00f3n would go to villages to hear older people sing. One learns there.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 Has being the father of one of the members of Ketama allowed you to always view flamenco fusion with respect?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 They have their place in the flamenco world. They\u2019ve made 20 records and revolutionised music. They are also children of flamenco, they\u2019ve learned from pure flamenco. Then they went their own way, Ketama\u2019s way, and made an impact. They\u2019ve been an important group in Spain.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 The musicologist Faustino N\u00fa\u00f1ez recently wrote a reflection on modernity on this website. In his words, the avant-garde is one thing and butchering the sole\u00e1<\/em> is another.<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 Ole<\/em>! It\u2019s true, it\u2019s true. Faustino is a phenomenon. I have also played seguiriyas <\/em>with double bass by Dave Holland and trumpet by Don Cherry. And you always learn. The great international musicians go crazy for flamenco. But yes, many people make flamenco fusions for the sake of it. To each his own conscience. But to make flamenco fusion one must know all the laws of flamenco.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 I\u2019m going to quote another recent statement, this time from the maestro Paco Cepero. Our director, Manuel Boh\u00f3rquez, interviewed him some weeks back in his house in Jerez. At one point, Cepero said that Paco de Luc\u00eda had learned the soniquete from him.<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 I had heard something about that. Man, I wouldn\u2019t have said those things. That man was a genius. Number one in the world. He wasn\u2019t lacking anything, he had it all. It\u2019s all nonsense.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 Flamenco guitarrists, like singers, chase duende<\/em> (magic). Is it so hard to find?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 Duende<\/em> (magic) is something very rare. It either comes or it doesn\u2019t. When it\u2019s there, you feel at ease and beautiful things happen without even realising. And you don\u2019t even remember them.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 Have you been criticised much for playing the guitar for the odd unorthodox artist? Those stars on the balcony in Pamplona…<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 I\u2019ve never made a mistake about that. For example, I\u2019ve done things with Ojos de Brujo. You go and learn with those people. It\u2019s fine.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\u2013 What would you say from the lectern when collecting your award to the fans of jondo<\/em> singing?<\/strong><\/p>\n

\u2013 That they listen to old flamenco. Mature flamenco. That\u2019s the foundation. That\u2019s where we\u2019ve all learned, from our elders. That\u2019s real flamenco.<\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

Images of Pepe Habichuela: provided by Edere Comunicaci\u00f3n<\/h6>\n
Translation: Lauren Bleakley<\/h6>\n

 <\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

\"\"<\/a><\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n

 <\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

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